Although not an omega this is a vectra b with the X30 3.0 ltr engine, and is owned by my brother in law, His car was originaly a 2.5 but suffered tensioner failure and destroyed a good motor by punching a hole in one of the pistons, so i had a X30 engine sitting in my garage and offered it to him as a replacement, Before we fitted it and while it was on an engine stand it was fitted with a new oil cooler and Gen vx belt Kitand replaced all orings and intake seals where needed.
The engine was fitted by a pal who works for vx and the car ran absolutly fantastic untill a couple of weeks ago when it started to missfire and run like a pig
The belt tensioner had collapsed and the belt became lose and jumped 6 teeth and caused valve damage to the rear bank of cylinders. Because the betl was loose it flapped about and the torx bolt just above the tensioner  munched  grove in the belt.
The new TENSIONER HAD DONE JUST 12,000 MILES........
Why are gm not supplying parts that will reach the spec'ed change intervals, it is a scandal that we as owners do everything that vx say we should do and then the parts that we buy are as good as a chocolate teapot.
So the situation is as we type  a dead vectra and gm laughing it's guts out..... i AM VERY p*****d off.
So is my brother in law. >:(

Feel for you, I KNOW that feeling, not good at all.  :'(

My question is......was the tensioner nut properly torqued up using a torque wrench, was the proper locking kit etc used and was the tension set right?

Yes mark, the gen vx locking kit was used and nut torqued, i watched him do it so ii know that was all as should be.

i have had the beginning of tensioner failure too!

brand new GM belt kit, correctly torqued tensioners, squeeking like hell, so replaced the whole kit. That had done 27k, so again very early!

I have had the same,  the tensioner managed to get half way through its life buts its bl@@dy lucky i cought it in time.

The job was done correctly when it was changed in 2007 as a famous OOF'er did it for me. :)

Can't believe mine managed 80k  :o

Gary, when you say "The belt tensioner had collapsed" what was the exact failure mode? I can see that the bearing might fail, the spring tensioner could go limp or the bolt could work loose. Just wondering, if the failure mode were known, whether potential duds could be spotted or additional meaures taken to avoid failure.

Hi Marie [smiley=vrolijk_26.gif] long time no see! How's it going?

Kevin

Mine was changed for the first time earlier this year, after 142,000Kms.  :o

Kevin, the ballraces have failed because the seal keeping the bearings lubricated had leaked the grease out and thus bearings had overheated and failed.  >:(

ffcgary1 wrote on 13. Dec 2009 at 14:49:

Kevin, the ballraces have failed because the seal keeping the bearings lubricated had leaked the grease out and thus bearings had overheated and failed.  >:(

Ooh. That's not good. :(

Kevin

What is most annoying is that GM know that the bearings that they are using are crap. but they still keep bunging em out knowing that if they fail they will just keep washing their hands of the problem. Our problem not theirs. >:(

Glad I used a Gates kit... Although I must confess I think I'll be changing it early... I've done 30k on it already and it'll be due changing just when I'm busiest ::) ::)

ffcgary1 wrote on 13. Dec 2009 at 14:49:

Kevin, the ballraces have failed because the seal keeping the bearings lubricated had leaked the grease out and thus bearings had overheated and failed.  >:(

That is the mode of failure I usually see too

ffcgary1 wrote on 13. Dec 2009 at 22:27:

What is most annoying is that GM know that the bearings that they are using are crap. but they still keep bunging em out knowing that if they fail they will just keep washing their hands of the problem. Our problem not theirs. >:(

Do you know what brand of bearings it had ?

I wonder if it's worth sourcing decent bearings and replacing them?

.. or just use Gates / SKF / Contitech kits...

Kevin

Both Contitech and Gates use SKF bearings and I suspect they source thier tensioners etc from the same suppliers.

Now given that Gm source thier kits from Contitech and Gates, and having looked at a Gm kit recently that also had SKF bearings, its a reasonable inference that they are also the same.

I have seen a few failures like this, 3 of which were well past thier 'due to be changed' date, the other had been over tensioned (which increases the load on the bearing).

Dont worry about the grease to much, any 2RS (or other shielded race) type bearing will dump some of its grease during its initial running, so seeing some grease is normal.

I guess we will not know the route cause, was it tensioned correctly, was it torqued up correclty (sounds like it was given the bearing has siezed)....who knows

Marks DTM Calib wrote on 14. Dec 2009 at 11:13:

Dont worry about the grease to much, any 2RS (or other shielded race) type bearing will dump some of its grease during its initial running, so seeing some grease is normal.

Thats re assuring.
On reading this thread i went directly to the garage to check my old cam belt kit,( havent got round to throwing it out yet), to take a closer look at the tensioner bearing as i remember seeing some grease thrown out due to centrafugal force.

It showed grease from the inner most edge of the seal escaping as lines radiating out from the centre ,as it would. All 3 bearings show the exact same thing. Presumed it to be normal esp after spinning the bearings. Still some stiffness left in them esp. as the grease was cold in the garage last night, not quite freezing.

I fully intended to check my belt after a year or so, just to check the timing on bank 1 and 2 to see if it settled in and retarded a fraction from where i set it and that the tension is still correct. Wouldn't do any harm, if i ever get round to it.

Ps not much comfort to the op tho. Sorry to hear
this Gary.

I have to say that the reason that it failed was due to  poor seals on the tensioner and GM should be willing to entertain claims on failure since this has been known to them for many years now.
My brother in law has decided to get rid of it now as he has lost all confidence in it now, he still likes the car and was stunned at the performance of the 3.0 engine but wont spend a wad of dosh on a car he cant  fully expect to reach the next belt change schedual. And i have to say i agree with him. :(

it happens mate. Even chains fail early. :-(

Warranty worth persuing, tensioner itself "should" be evidence enough. Easy sitting here though. :-(

I've never had any problems with GM kits fit them all the time, guess you always get one?
Have to admit the grease don't stay in the rollers very well, looks like it always flys out

ffcgary1 wrote on 15. Dec 2009 at 18:54:

I have to say that the reason that it failed was due to  poor seals on the tensioner and GM should be willing to entertain claims on failure since this has been known to them for many years now. My brother in law has decided to get rid of it now as he has lost all confidence in it now, he still likes the car and was stunned at the performance of the 3.0 engine but wont spend a wad of dosh on a car he cant  fully expect to reach the next belt change schedual. And i have to say i agree with him. :(

Thats little more than an inference based on little evidence.

Given its a standard bearing design and from a reasonably regarded supplier plus there are 100's of millions of this type of bearing on loads more different applications......I would infer thast not the cause.

It could be so many things that caused it.......

Maybe your right mark and i fully respect everything you say, but if the seal is fitted to the bearing to stop the grease being ejected then it aint doing what it is designed to do, which makes it a faulty design. Gm know whats going on, they have had enough claims over the years for the same failure, coinsidence, dont think so. :(
Anyway, merry xmas to to everyone on this forum and heres to a much better new year. Rant over. :y

ffcgary1 wrote on 16. Dec 2009 at 17:31:

Maybe your right mark and i fully respect everything you say, but if the seal is fitted to the bearing to stop the grease being ejected then it aint doing what it is designed to do, which makes it a faulty design. Gm know whats going on, they have had enough claims over the years for the same failure, coinsidence, dont think so. :( Anyway, merry xmas to to everyone on this forum and heres to a much better new year. Rant over. :y

Lets look at the mechanics of what is happening (note, this is so we all understand why bearings are constructed how they are and to give further insight into why we see grease).......the bearing is made and packed with grease, they err on the 'to much' side knowing that any extra will be forced out as this is a much safer approach than to little.

Plus its not possible to guarantee exact delivery of the 'perfect' quantity due to real life manufacturing tolerances.

Seals are fitted and then during running, the extra grease is forced out.

The key thing to note is the seal design, its fitted to the outer race and runs against the inner race, hence centrifugal force forces the grease to the outer race...this is not a problems as its a sealed face and as the balls within  the bearings rotate they are re-lubed.

Any grease that exits comes through the small gap between the inner race and seal and exits outwards towards the outer race section (you can see this as lines of grease).

There is no fundamental design floor in the bearing make up.  :y

Not saying it's the case inthis situation for one minute - but generally failures are cause by incorrect setting up.

Edit- Bah - Maria is logged on!

Again, my apologies, the above post was me  :(

JamesV6CDX wrote on 16. Dec 2009 at 19:16:

Again, my apologies, the above post was me  :(

Changed your name then? ;D ;D ;)

ffcgary1 wrote on 16. Dec 2009 at 17:31:

Maybe your right mark and i fully respect everything you say, but if the seal is fitted to the bearing to stop the grease being ejected then it aint doing what it is designed to do, which makes it a faulty design. Gm know whats going on, they have had enough claims over the years for the same failure, coinsidence, dont think so. :( Anyway, merry xmas to to everyone on this forum and heres to a much better new year. Rant over. :y

The seals will not keep grease in the bearing if the bearing overheats, or if it starts to fail for any other reason eg overloading. once it starts to wear, the Grease will be expelled as the seal will no longer be effective. rapid wear will then ensue and may make it seem like worn seals were the cause of the failure rather than just a symptom of it.

All these horror stories about premature tensioner failure make me wonder whether it might be worth hole sawing an inspection hole,say 35mm diameter in the plastic belt cover and fitting a blind grommet to enable regular inspections of the bearing just to make sure that it is not about to expire...

I recently changed the belt kit and waterpump on my
4 pot and was a little surprised at how many times
I had to hand wind the engine over to settle everything.
I had to set and retorque the tensioner 3 times before
it would hold the correct tension, and this was with
turning the camshafts through at least 4 revolutions
between each retorque.

The first attempt the tensioner lost all its tension, the
second time it lost half its tension and the third time
it remained correctly tensioned.

The belt is under its main tension loading on the length
on the right hand side where the crank is pulling against
the load of the camshafts via a single idler pulley.
When it comes off the crank on the left hand side
it is relatively idling around the tensioner, idler and
waterpump so this is where any slack needs to be
taken up as the belt is in a relatively relaxed phase
in comparison.

As said, I had to handwind the engine over so many
times to condition and settle the belt I was bloody
cream-crackered when I'd finished.  ;D

I intend to whip the aux belt and cambelt cover off
when I've done a few more hundred miles and recheck
the tension and timing. That is if I've still got it by then.
Mrs Grumpy has her eye on a Merc C class Sporthatch
that she's trying to talk me into lobbing the Omega in
against on a part exchange deal. All that extra money
for an inferior car.  :'(

Tensioner falure cause the death of my first miggy.  :'(

I've been lucky so far as I am basically paranoid about this issue and so keep a very close 'ear' on things.  I had the first belt and tensioner/roller set changed at 39000 miles, all quiet and no badness visible, could have left it but I'm not like that!  So GM dealer ( a generally very good one unusually!) fitted the replacement, and after 16000 miles I was listening to a bearing squeal on start-up that was in the area of the tensioner.  Took off the aux belt, still made the noise, but bizarrely if I drove it every 1/2 day (i.e. twice a day or more) it stopped doing it, only if left overnight to go stone cold would it complain.  Anyway, took it to dealer who declared  they couldn't ear it (you could have heard it in the next county on start-up) but agreed to change the kit and send the original one to VX to get their opinion on who should pay for the work. They paid, bearing stuffed.  So the next (third kit) gets to 26000 miles and same noise starts again.  Sod it, called Darth Loo-Knee and got him down to change the kit, so I could see what the dealer had done.  Gets the covers off and the water pump and all surfaces facing up are covered in what used to be part of the rubber surface of the belt. Checked tensioner - guess what massively over-tensioned from new.  I'm thinking this is what caused the first kit to go as well.

The good news, Darth Loo Knee re-timed the cams (yes they were out as well, thanks VX) fitted new belt, SKF tensioners and rollers, new water pump, and it is as quiet as a mouse and much, much smoother at idle and running, so I am a happy man now.  I also know that it was tensioned correctly and all the bolts were torqued properly and that a lot of care was taken.  Thank you Darth. Car runs really well and is so quiet I could forget it even has an engine up front, caught myself out once or twice of late going a tad too quickly.

It has restored my faith that a properly fitted kit will last the distance and that my ears haven't failed me yet so my engine is fine.  Car is now at 89000 miles and on kit no.4, but cam belt kits are much cheaper than engines so I don't really mind since the car is such a pleasure to drive.

My advice, fit the things properly and don't push past 40000 miles or at any time you get a bearing noise, stop the engine and change it there and then.  I will happily recommend Darth Loo-Knee, he did a top job and was not terribly expensive.