Omega Owners Forum - Non Starting 2.2 - Janine

JamesV6CDX

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Non Starting 2.2 - Janine - Initial Checks Done
23. Dec 2010 at 22:32

Hi all,

Please can I ask for some opinions/advice.

I travelled up to Swindon tonight to have an initial look at Janine's 2.2 16v, that won't start.

It's turning over as if it has compression.

It has a spark at the plugs.

There is a spurt of fuel from the rail when you press the relief valve in, indicating fuel.

The failure mode was - fine one min, wouldn't start the next.

I attached the OP-Com, and fault codes that were returned, were:

P1526 - (8) Throttle Position no Adaption - Present

P1550 - (4) Electronic Throttle Control Power Management - Present

P1650 - (4) Service Vehicle Soon Light Voltage Low - Present

I cleared these codes out - but when you turn ignition off, back on, and read again - the codes come back. Sometimes they don't come back until you crank the engine again.

This is as far as I could get tonight given the dark/time constraints, and I plan to look in more detail, but can anyone give any advice re. the fault codes, and how this might relate to the non starting?

I have reseated all visible connectors, incl the DBW one, to no avail.

I also tried starting the engine with the DBW connector off (I know it will run, but not rev, in this circumstance), and it wouldn't start this way either.

I'd appreciate opinions on how to take this forward.

Many thanks in anticipation.

Kind regards,
James

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« Last Edit: 23. Dec 2010 at 22:57 by JamesV6CDX »

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freecall666 Senior Member Offline fun for all, get with the program Posts: 656 looking over your shoulder Gender: Drives: 2.0I polar sea blue	Re: None Starting 2.2 - Janine - Initial Checks Done Reply #1 - 23. Dec 2010 at 22:35 clean the plugs up on the faults see if that helps, if not try restart take battery off, and leave for a hour then put back on somtimes works.
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idc62 Junior Member Offline Posts: 72 Llanharry south wales Gender: Drives: x reg 2.0ltr gls auto previously senator 2.5 auto c reg senator g reg auto b reg carlton m reg cavalier 2ltr auto gls	Re: None Starting 2.2 - Janine - Initial Checks Done Reply #2 - 23. Dec 2010 at 22:37 hi is it a auto box mig cheers ian
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JamesV6CDX

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Re: None Starting 2.2 - Janine - Initial Checks Done
Reply #3 - 23. Dec 2010 at 22:38

freecall666 wrote on 23. Dec 2010 at 22:35:

clean the plugs up on the faults see if that helps, if not try restart take battery off, and leave for a hour then put back on somtimes works.

Hi Freecall,

Plugs had a good spark, I'm not convinced cleaning them would make the difference between starting or not.

Also, I'm not aware taking the battery off would make any difference, on the basis the ECU will store the codes in non-volatile memory (and were cleared with the diag kit)

The battery has also been off all day.

Many thanks for the suggestions though.

Kind regards,
James

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JamesV6CDX Omega Baron Offline Posts: 3202 Gloucestershire Gender: Drives: 2002 (02) 3.2 Retail MV6 in Star Silver with Leather	Re: None Starting 2.2 - Janine - Initial Checks Done Reply #4 - 23. Dec 2010 at 22:38 idc62 wrote on 23. Dec 2010 at 22:37: hi is it a auto box mig cheers ian Hi Ian, Yes, it is an automatic. Kind regards, James
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freecall666

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Re: None Starting 2.2 - Janine - Initial Checks Done
Reply #5 - 23. Dec 2010 at 22:41

JamesV6CDX wrote on 23. Dec 2010 at 22:38:

freecall666 wrote on 23. Dec 2010 at 22:35:

clean the plugs up on the faults see if that helps, if not try restart take battery off, and leave for a hour then put back on somtimes works.

Hi Freecall,

Plugs had a good spark, I'm not convinced cleaning them would make the difference between starting or not.

Also, I'm not aware taking the battery off would make any difference, on the basis the ECU will store the codes in non-volatile memory (and were cleared with the diag kit)

The battery has also been off all day.

Many thanks for the suggestions though.

Kind regards,
James

sorry ment the plugs that have faults, not spark plugs, look for white cream on them, also the seal's on them if the rubber gose water can get it and do some damage.

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JamesV6CDX

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Re: None Starting 2.2 - Janine - Initial Checks Done
Reply #6 - 23. Dec 2010 at 22:43

freecall666 wrote on 23. Dec 2010 at 22:41:

JamesV6CDX wrote on 23. Dec 2010 at 22:38:

freecall666 wrote on 23. Dec 2010 at 22:35:

clean the plugs up on the faults see if that helps, if not try restart take battery off, and leave for a hour then put back on somtimes works.

Hi Freecall,

Plugs had a good spark, I'm not convinced cleaning them would make the difference between starting or not.

Also, I'm not aware taking the battery off would make any difference, on the basis the ECU will store the codes in non-volatile memory (and were cleared with the diag kit)

The battery has also been off all day.

Many thanks for the suggestions though.

Kind regards,
James

sorry ment the plugs that have faults, not spark plugs, look for white cream on them, also the seal's on them if the rubber gose water can get it and do some damage.

Hi Freecall,

Many thanks for clarifying.

I did remove and re-seat the electrical connectors in question, all appeared to be dry and fine.

Kind regards,
James

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freecall666

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Re: None Starting 2.2 - Janine - Initial Checks Done
Reply #7 - 23. Dec 2010 at 22:47

JamesV6CDX wrote on 23. Dec 2010 at 22:32:

Hi all,

Please can I ask for some opinions/advice.

I travelled up to Swindon tonight to have an initial look at Janine's 2.2 16v, that won't start.

It's turning over as if it has compression.

It has a spark at the plugs.

There is a spurt of fuel from the rail when you press the relief valve in, indicating fuel.

The failure mode was - fine one min, wouldn't start the next.

I attached the OP-Com, and fault codes that were returned, were:

P1526 - (8) Throttle Position no Adaption - Present

P1550 - (4) Electronic Throttle Control Power Management - Present

P1650 - (4) Service Vehicle Soon Light Voltage Low - PresentI cleared these codes out - but when you turn ignition off, back on, and read again - the codes come back. Sometimes they don't come back until you crank the engine again.

This is as far as I could get tonight given the dark/time constraints, and I plan to look in more detail, but can anyone give any advice re. the fault codes, and how this might relate to the non starting?

I have reseated all visible connectors, incl the DBW one, to no avail.

I also tried starting the engine with the DBW connector off (I know it will run, but not rev, in this circumstance), and it wouldn't start this way either.

I'd appreciate opinions on how to take this forward.

Many thanks in anticipation.

Kind regards,
James

just checked and these are all on same line of volts. could be from battery to main fuse box bad earth or live wire.

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idc62

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Llanharry south wales
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Drives: x reg 2.0ltr gls auto previously senator 2.5 auto c reg senator g reg auto b reg carlton m reg cavalier 2ltr auto gls

Re: None Starting 2.2 - Janine - Initial Checks Done
Reply #8 - 23. Dec 2010 at 22:50

hi james
i had a lot of those symptoms on my 2.0ltr 4 pot 16v changed cam and crank sensor no go changed dis still same would run then not would not start then would and would stall and not start turned out to be auto box switch full of gooey sludge stripped and cleaned with thinners dried with hair drier not had an ounce of trouble in 3 mths hope this helps cheers ian Thumbs Up!

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JamesV6CDX

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Re: None Starting 2.2 - Janine - Initial Checks Done
Reply #9 - 23. Dec 2010 at 22:53

idc62 wrote on 23. Dec 2010 at 22:50:

hi james
i had a lot of those symptoms on my 2.0ltr 4 pot 16v changed cam and crank sensor no go changed dis still same would run then not would not start then would and would stall and not start turned out to be auto box switch full of gooey sludge stripped and cleaned with thinners dried with hair drier not had an ounce of trouble in 3 mths hope this helps cheers ian Thumbs Up!

Hi Ian,

Sorry if I'm wrong, but I'm not sure how the Automatic gearbox selector switch would prevent the engine from actually starting at all?

Kind regards,
James

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idc62

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Drives: x reg 2.0ltr gls auto previously senator 2.5 auto c reg senator g reg auto b reg carlton m reg cavalier 2ltr auto gls

Re: None Starting 2.2 - Janine - Initial Checks Done
Reply #10 - 23. Dec 2010 at 23:00

it does alot more to your car than you think and all that sludge mess up electrics through it wish id gone to it first on mine the repair would of only cost time not the three parts i bought never mind its only money Grin

cheers ian

its also a start inhibitor switch i think 4 little tangs to make contact through the goo

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« Last Edit: 23. Dec 2010 at 23:05 by idc62 »

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Kevin Wood

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Re: None Starting 2.2 - Janine - Initial Checks Done
Reply #11 - 23. Dec 2010 at 23:01

The codes point to a problem with the drive-by-wire throttle. Could be it's not responding to the ECU and therefore can't open far enough to start it from cold.

First step is to give it a good clean and make sure the throttle moves freely by hand and isn't mechanically jammed. If that's to no avail double check the connections at the throttle and ECU end and the wiring between.

There is a procedure to follow in TIS - checking resistance of some connections at the ECU connector and applying power to the throttle motor to see if it moves.

Would also be worth looking at the live data with the throttle removed but still connected electrically. See if manual movement of the throttle affects the reported position in live data. There may also be an "actuator check" procedure though not sure if you need a Tech 2 to run it.

Kevin

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freecall666 Senior Member Offline fun for all, get with the program Posts: 656 looking over your shoulder Gender: Drives: 2.0I polar sea blue	Re: Non Starting 2.2 - Janine - Initial Checks Done Reply #12 - 23. Dec 2010 at 23:13 there are 5 earth wires under the battery says they earth there.
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tunnie Over Active Poster Offline Posts: 22520 London, W3 Gender: Drives: 2.2 CD (LPG'd) & BMW R1200 GS	Re: Non Starting 2.2 - Janine - Initial Checks Done Reply #13 - 24. Dec 2010 at 09:43 throttle body move ok?
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TheBoy

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Re: None Starting 2.2 - Janine - Initial Checks Done
Reply #14 - 24. Dec 2010 at 11:04

idc62 wrote on 23. Dec 2010 at 23:00:

it does alot more to your car than you think and all that sludge mess up electrics through it wish id gone to it first on mine the repair would of only cost time not the three parts i bought never mind its only money Grin

cheers ian

its also a start inhibitor switch i think 4 little tangs to make contact through the goo

If it was selector switch, engine wouldn't turn over.

James - as others have pointed out, the next port of call is to check the throttle moves, and that the ecu can also see this movement.

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